Kentucky Seizes 141 Gambling Domains
The commonwealth of Kentucky issued a seizure order on September 18, ordering 141 domains be taken from their registrants.
order-of-seizure-of-domain-names (adobe Reader Required)
“”The Domain names shall be immediately transferred by their respective registrars to an account of the Commonwealth of Kentucky “”.
The seizure was taken after the Commonwealth found that the “domains were being used in connection with illegal gambling activity”.
However some of these domains are simply parked domains not sites taking bets.
The domains seized include: (the full list is on the adobe file)
fulltiltpoker.com
indiancasino.com
bet21.com
allslots.com
bodoglife.com
bookmaker.com
SportsBook.com
SportsBetting.com
superslots.com
pokerstars.com
doylesroom.com
GoldenPalace.com
As far as I can tell, no notice of this action was given to any of the registrants, nor was any hearing held giving the registrants an opportunity to appear
The order does talk about the court holding a hearing sometime in September to for registrants who want to claim there domain “qualifies for return”
Obviously a very scary tactic taken by one state.
Another reason you might want to consider moving your domains to a registrar outside of the US, as this order is to the registrars of the domains, not the central registry.
Whether this move can stand legal challenge is highly questionable.
The order did state that the “domain configurations shall remain unchanged”, so the domains should continue to resolve to the registrant’s sites. This may be an attempt to greatly limit the commonwealth damages in the event this “order” is overturned.
What is another state decided tommorow to seize adult domains, because they contained illegal obsence material?
This will not cause the registrants to hire legal representation, go to Kentucky and try to get their property back.
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This is totally 1930’s Fascism.
Next it will be website domains about any subject that is on the latest knee-jerk reaction list.
Has the KY state Gov, actually read the US constitution, especially the bill of rights.
Also regarding FABULOUS, maybe not a good choice as Godaddy is a Major shareholder.
Moniker.com is now owned by Oversee.net with offices in CA, OR, and FL.
Still looking, can anyone help? Who do you use for non-U.S. domain registration?
wtf? kentucky? of all states, you’d think it’s be cali or some other uber-liberal place…. not Appalachian-America.
kentucky has NO bearing over me or the internet. i am not in kentucky, nor is my server or domains hosted there. what right would they have to take my .com ’s?
The answer is, they don’t. And anyone not fighting this with Johhny Cochrane-style lawyers should pay attention.
I am concerned over this. We U.S. citizens have the illusion of choice and the illusion of freedom, and this seizure is a lesson in hard reality. We have become used to the unacceptable by degree.
The government does what is in the interest of the government without heed to the will of the people nor due process. Seizure is a huge source of governmental revenue.
Our present form of government is correctly termed ‘monocracy’ (political authority in the hands of those with money). This is just government doing what government does based upon the goverment actually is.
The state will not loose, it has nothing whatsoever to do with right and wrong, legal and illegal.
And if this is occuring in KY, it is under way in other states.
Also, this can “make” someone’s career in law enforcement, legislature, etc. Other bodies are sure to follow.
There are just too many $$$ plusses to these seizures for them to not escalate, be reversed, or not expand.
My point is to move domains now, as in immediately. Get them out of reach.
BTW, GoDaddy partnered with Fabulous on monetization, they are not stockholers. Still waiting to hear back from them.
The Godaddy Deal with Dark Blue Sea Limited
also involved Godaddy being given options for nearly 7% of the Company.
David,
Can you provide a link?
eurodns.com and fabulous.com are the 2 known and trustworthy non US registrars.
The court order indicated it was in rem:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_rem
No wonder Rick never got any notice about it. The registrars doesn’t really have to notify him of such unless their agreements says so.
But doesn’t Rick have his own registrar? Or surely he can afford to have an offshore one like Frank?
http://www.darkbluesea.com/announcements/295_GoDaddy_ASX_Announcement_7_March_(2).pdf
FX
Fabulous told me personally, that they will comply with the order.
Being an Australian company they most comply with orders issued by a competent court which a US court is.
Thank you, David, GoDaddy and Fabulous are in fact partnered.
Hi MHB,
Not sure who you have been speaking with but that is not the case.
Who have you been speaking with?
Thanks
Peter
This is turning into a hot topic! Now MHB has to respond with an answer, don’t you think?
Kentuckians! If you are reading, maybe you should pick up a copy of “The Law” and think about the ramifications of your actions. Here’s a link, go for it! You need it!
http://www.constitution.org/law/bastiat.htm
Peter, thanks for being on top of this.
Well, just like China and TIbet, they want to control the internet but in USA, they steal our domains.
Kentucky has internet access? lol
and should I be worried if I own Kentucky.tk?
Sorry to hear about Rick’s precious domain. I would be out of my mind calling lawyers.
I’m in Australia and use GoDaddy. Whats GoDaddy’s stand on this?
Mick
Godaddy is a US company and must comply
Peter
I had lunch with Michael Robertson today in New York
He told me fabulos would comply, actually had to comply, with a court order issued by an American court.
A registrant would have to file a action in preferably a Australian court for them to hold on the domain
Just to clarify our process as relates to competent jurisdiction:
The important 2 things to look at here are:
- The Registrar
- The Registrant (being the whois information)
The basic process for us is as follows:
- Registrar jurisdiction (in our case being Brisbane, Queensland Australia)
- Registrants jurisdiction (as per the whois information)
Examples
- If the court order was from the Registrars jurisdiction (eg: a court in Queensland) then we would need to abide by that court order
- If the court order was from a court of the Registrants jurisdiction (eg: Registrant from the State of Kentucky and the court order from the state of Kentucky) then it is highly likely we would need to comply.
- If the court order was from a court other than the Registrants jurisdiction (eg: Registrant from the State of Kentucky and the court order from the state of California or another country) then we would seek our Registrants (our customers) instructions on how they wanted to proceed. We would then proceed in terms of those instructions.
Should any one have any questions please do not hesitate to email me directly.
Thanks
Peter
John
Godaddy and Fabulous partnership is a marketing one and would not effect this matter
Hi Michael,
I just made a post 1 minute after you and did not see your post.
I think there has been some mis-communication on this and I hope that my previous post clarifies our process for all concerned.
If not please let me know.
Thanks
Peter
Peter
I understand exactly what you are saying but it is not what Michael told me when we discussed this exact issue in detail. During our discussion, i asked many questions and did not mis-understand what he said.
He told me very clearly in this situation, with the facts known to all, he would have to follow the order of the Kentucky court.
If Fabulous position is different than that related to me by Michael today I am glad to hear it.
To clarify you are saying fabulous has not complied with the court order; The domains remain in the registrants accounts and will continue to remain int he registrants accounts and not be transferred to Kentucky or a disputed account maintained by Fab, correct
Hi Michael,
In this instance our customer is not in the jurisdiction of Kentucky.
We have asked our customer for their instructions on how they wish to proceed in this matter. We will then proceed in terms of those instructions.
How we proceed is up to our customer.
Please let me know if this satisfies your question.
Thanks
Peter
Hey Peter, that’s pretty much the same or similar grounds the registrar I worked with in a previous life would also do. Thanks for clarifying Fabulous’ matter.
That’s why I would never live in US. It looks like only webmasters and domain owners have sense of reason and all other are totally ……….. “patriots”
Great response to this post by Rick Schwartz and David J Castello.
I have known that this day will be here – this is JUST the begining of the Criminal activity by the Legal Criminal Element
Pretty stupid. The content and the domain are two different things.
I remember when InterNIC refused to register f*cking.com because of profanity. Later Europeans took it (and similar domains).
@Namington: They also refused to register “shitakemushrooms.com” until the subject became a big enough embarrassment for them.
wow, didn’t expect something like this from the government of the land of the free…
Does Kentucky even have any legal authority to do something? If the registrar isn’t in Kentucky nor the servers?
@Oskars: Hey, they have to protect their horseracing and them darn internet tubes run through Kentucky!
Florida makes a lot of money from tourism, maybe we should seize all domains remotely related to California and/or sunshine.
What I don’t understand is why the state of Kentucky feels they have jurisdiction over these domains. Unless the businesses are headquartered in Kentucky or the domains are infringing on a copyright, I fail to see how they have any claim ??
In the end it will just be egg on the face for a hillbilly red state.
No more vacation in the Turkey state.
It is all about self interest.
You know who is supporting this…the real indian casinos.
They hate hate online gambling.
and worst of all, they pump in money to their state representatives. bri-be
Money buys votes and money buy lobbyists.
That’s pretty much the question bugging a lot around here. Unfortunately as two blog entries subsequently stated, eNom and Go Daddy gave in without seemingly (?) giving their respective registrants a say.
Dave
Kentucky can take any position they want, just like anyone can sue you for anything at anytime.
The question to be decided does Kentucky have the right, power and jurisdiction to take such action
This will be decided by a court.
Unfortunately some of the registrars did not give the registrants an opportunity to hear the merits of their cases.
Once the domains are turned over the arguments are not heard and the registrars make the determination instead of the court
Kentucky grabs third domain name GoldenCasino.com:
http://www.point-spreads.com/industry/092508-internet-gambling-forfeiture-hearing-postponed-kentucky-grabs-goldencasino.com.html
Soon, the will grab any extension like in, mobi, cn ,net, org…
they want everything!!!
I am having a hard time reading this – doesn’t seem possible but it appears to be.
If Kentucky (of all places) can just “seize” domains, what’s next?
L II
L II
Exactly
This is why the industry must fight this and not allow it to simply stand
But parked domains are ok or not? WTF?
Lukas
Some of the 141 domains were parked domains.
How come the gambling affiliations not fighting this?
Soon, they will take away wine, car, alcohol, beer gun domains…
what does this going to stop?
Hi Micheal,
since you are discussing NON US registrars I wanted to let your readers know that Rebel.com is a Canadian based registrar with a large domainer customer base. We would be happy to answer any questions about how Rebel.com would address situations such as this.
Jason
Ok I’ll bite, how would you handle this exact situation if one of these 141 domains seized in Kentucky was registered with your registrar?
Micheal,
Rebel.com is located in Ontario, Canada and as such we would respond to court orders issued through the Ontario Provincial Court or the Federal Court of Canada. We would challenge all other court orders based on jurisdiction and have done so in the past.
We also make every effort to ensure our customers remain informed of any and all issues concerning their domains.
Does Rebel.Com have any physical presence in the United Statese?
Does it have any binding financial or business arrangements (such as partnering with Godaddy or monetization, etc) that would hurt Rebel.Com if they were to be severed?
I think getting severed would hurt anyone…
Hi John,
Good question, Rebel.com has no physical presence within the US and we have no ties or partnerships with any US companies.